[00:00:00.000] - Brandon Reece
[00:00:50.320] - Chris Nordyke
What's up, man?
[00:00:50.960] - Brandon Reece
How are you doing, brother?
[00:00:52.000] - Chris Nordyke
Really good. I feel like I've officially taken over the opening light.
[00:00:54.880] - Brandon Reece
I have noticed that, but it was like, what's the saying? A frog I don't know it's getting boiled or something because it's slow over time, the temperature keeps or maybe that's a crab.
[00:01:05.820] - Chris Nordyke
I'm already getting bored. It's a little too easy.
[00:01:07.440] - Brandon Reece
Yeah, it's like you've taken over officially. Kind of, Sort of. Move on, the challenge is over.
[00:01:11.140] - Chris Nordyke
Dude, I got to say, this is the first interview we've done. It's like this. I have another jiu-jitsu buddy that we may get on. It's a national... Oh, cool. He's an MMA fighter, too. But this is a little bit of a turn for us. It is, yeah. Down a little rabbit hole. And holy cow, man.
[00:01:25.040] - Brandon Reece
I know.
[00:01:25.760] - Chris Nordyke
This is really fun.
[00:01:26.900] - Brandon Reece
It's a fun show and he's just animal. For those of you that will end up watching this episode on video, you'll see he's got the fighter DNA. Wayne's a perfect example. Guys and gals that put their time in the trenches as fighters, you see it.
[00:01:46.480] - Chris Nordyke
You see it on him. I think all of us have been watching this trend of our friends, relatives maybe talking about jiu-jitsu. I just joined a gym. Oh, my gosh, it's so great. There's a lot of evangelism around jiu-jitsu right now. I did three months in a jiu-jitsu gym and then broke my hand, which really probably has more to do with me than jiu-jitsu. But my boy just started doing jiu-jitsu. If you're curious or if you're one of the converted, you're probably going to really enjoy this chat. But I think for me, my biggest takeaway is his mentor. It was a really special through line through the whole conversation. It just constantly referencing back to what this mentor did for him in his life and what it still means to him today. That really is captivating for me. It makes me want to meet the guy. It makes me want to go out to this place.
[00:02:36.160] - Brandon Reece
Yeah, I think Alejandro, when you listen to his story and his journey and what he's created with that effort and that success, and now the level of influence he has in his own community and the coaching programs that they run. Man, I think it's pretty clear for people to see this really distinct connection between what being committed to, let's say in this particular experience, do jitsu, that hard work, that humbling environment, that ego check at the door that he gets into, you can see how that easily translates into skill set that moves way beyond fighting and into things that we can apply to relationship, effort, the way that he's raising young fighters and wrest, how he's influencing them and helping them prepare their minds and their bodies for the hard work of life. The connections all over the place and the guy's just super humble and down to earth.
[00:03:33.220] - Chris Nordyke
The whole thing of building physical confidence, I just had a very brief experience with it. I feel like you and I, obviously, we do feel a certain it through the just weight training and being disciplined around that stuff. But I've seen it in my boys. There is something, and I don't think it's just for men. I think it's absolutely true for women, too. But there's definitely something really deep and innate in a man of knowing I can handle myself. Now, of course, you can have that feeling and still not be capable of handling yourself against some people. There's always going to be somebody that's bigger, stronger, faster, whatever. But there's this innate sense that when I encounter people who have really committed themselves to jiu-jitsu or some other form of fighting or grappling sport, there's a sense... One, I tend to experience them as having better self-control over their anger response. They tend to be less reactive, which is interesting. You would think somebody who's perfected the art of fighting It would be more reactive. But the ones who really are serious about it and high-skilled, they're not. They call him as a cucumber. We hung out with one of the superstars, I think, that comes up that he works with and we're all mutual friends with.
[00:04:42.760] - Chris Nordyke
I hung out with him at a music festival this last summer. It was the same deal. It was like he had nothing to prove. He rolled around. There was no arrogance attached to it. It was just like there was this sense of just self-knowing that I think we pick up and we get really in tune with our body, which is what these grappling arts, I think, help people do. Anyway, it's really interesting. You've been curious about jiu-jitsu where we go pretty deep into it, that and wrestling and all the things.
[00:05:07.430] - Brandon Reece
Yeah. Alejandro, he's literally a Pan Am world champ, black belt in over 10, 12 years of dedication to the sport, teaching it, training it. Award-winning college wrestler. Yeah, award-winning college. I mean, this guy has got winner written all over his life and his career so far, and I think you're going to hear pretty clearly how that's possible.
[00:05:28.780] - Chris Nordyke
It's fun. Wow. How many of you have listened to the Head, Heart, and Boots podcast? I can't tell you that react, how much that means to us.
[00:05:36.920] - Brandon Reece
Welcome back to the Head, Heart, and Boots podcast.
[00:05:39.840] - Chris Nordyke
I'm Chris.
[00:05:40.620] - Brandon Reece
And I'm Brandon. Join us as we wrestle with what it takes to transform ourselves and the businesses we lead. This new camera angle makes my arms look smaller than yours.
[00:05:50.350] - Chris Nordyke
I'm noticing that and I really appreciate it. I thought you did that on purpose.
[00:05:53.420] - Brandon Reece
No, I don't. I didn't, and I am not happy with it. Well, my friend, thanks a lot for joining This is going to be a fun experience. I think most of our listeners haven't had a chance to talk jiu-jitsu. And for whatever reason, man, in our industry, this is becoming a bigger and more popular thing where I'm meeting with business owners and leaders and they're like, yeah, One thing I found was jiu-jitsu, and here's what it's been doing in my life. We were really excited to get a real fighter on the show to share some of that experience and obviously some of the mindset that's translated into other areas of your life. Again, dude, thanks for hanging out with us spending some time on the show.
[00:06:31.380] - Chris Nordyke
I'm excited to meet another sibling of Sophia's, too, man. Oh, we love Sophia, dude. So this is especially fun because of that as well.
[00:06:38.970] - Brandon Reece
That's right.
[00:06:39.560] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, she's the best.
[00:06:40.880] - Brandon Reece
She's the best, man. Yeah. So inevitably, we'll have to hear some more of the story of how you talked her into joining the jiu-jitsu world for a while as well. She's got a bit of a story there that took us a little while to learn, but that's pretty exciting as well. Oh, yeah, totally. Right on, man. Well, let's just start with the 30 second life adventure. Give us the background on where you were raised, how you grew up, and then eventually, what ended up putting you in an environment where you ended up at Dazy Fresh and making your way through the ranks as a jiu-jitsu fighter.
[00:07:12.290] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, totally, bro. So I was born in Long Island New York. I'm the first born of four kids. And basically, I lived there for four or five years, moved to Connecticut, lived there for two years. When I was seven, I moved to South Florida, Naples, Florida area. Grade school all the way through high school. Started wrestling Keep in mind, I was not an athlete by any means. I tried to play all the sports, not good at very many. I was the guy on the baseball field when the coaches would be like, go to the outfield. I'm like, further. Keep going. You know what I mean? So I fell into wrestling. We're one of the football coaches because I was like, fourth string JV, never played. He was like, why don't you try for the wrestling team? I'm a coach on the wrestling program and we're pretty good. I got into wrestling in high school. My first year was brutally tough. But I saw little achievements and I saw myself getting better, even though I was not having success on paper. So I just glued myself to it and I stuck with it. And so I wrest all through high school, had a lot of success eventually, and wrestled in college after that because I just was obsessed with it.
[00:08:17.930] - Alejandro Wajner
I really liked it. So I left Florida, moved to the Midwest, into the St. Louis area, wrestled all five years of college. I graduated from Lindewood University, wrestled Division 2, NCAA. And then I got into cage fighting. I was fighting MMA at a amateur level right out of college. I was 2-0 in MMA, unde. At the time, I had been seeing a girl and we had got married when I was like 20, 21. I was too young. Our marriage didn't really work out very long. It crushed me. We were just too young. She was unfaithful to me and stuff. It really hurt me bad. I would have been in St. Louis area for five years, and I was training MMA exclusively out there. I was like, I got to get out of here now. My feelings are hurt from this break up. I'll do my MMA career somewhere else. I'll find a gym maybe in the West Coast or something like that. And at the time, Heath Pedigo, who's an owner and head coach at Pedigo Submission in Fighting, where I do Brazilian jiu-jitsu, he was calling to my MMA gym at the time, and he was teaching There's two classes there.
[00:09:15.980] - Alejandro Wajner
We were just friends. Just someone you see from time to time. You're like, Hey, good to see you, man. He reached out to me and he heard I was going through some issues, and he was like, Hey, bro, what's your plan? I told him my plan. And he was like, Look, it's a 36-hour drive to California. Why don't you drive an hour and a half to Mount Vernon? I'll let you sleep on the mats in the gym. You can train for free. And you can train full-time with some of the guys. We all train full-time and we run the circuit pretty hard. And at the time, our gym wasn't very well-known at all. That, yes, that wasn't very well-known at all. But I was like, I don't know. I got my heart set on this M&A thing. And he was like, look, give me two weeks with you. If you don't like it, I'll help you move to California. Wow. So I just said, okay, hour and a half compared to 36 hours, what's the risk? So I went down there to Heath. So we're at Pedigo Submission Fighting. I've been there ever since. He gave me a chance.
[00:10:02.610] - Brandon Reece
Let me just connect a couple of dots because I want to make sure I'm tracking with you. This story of life challenges, something happened, rocked you. You're looking for some extreme change in your environment and some of your relationships. This is not a too dissimilar story for Wayne. I'm not going to speak on Wayne's behalf, but he followed a similar track and ended up in this world that you've been a part of. We met this coach, the owner, at Wayne's Wedding, I believe. Oh, yeah.
[00:10:29.560] - Alejandro Wajner
Nice. You guys got to meet me, Eith.
[00:10:32.010] - Brandon Reece
Yeah. Man, the story of the relationships that this guy has built with the fighters, you're not alone, I guess, is what I'm trying to say in that theme. That's similar to a lot of the fighters that have had success under his leadership, right?
[00:10:46.420] - Alejandro Wajner
No, I'm just one of the first guys that was in the beginning before our gym got big. Okay. Plus, he has the same haircut as us.
[00:10:54.240] - Chris Nordyke
Yeah, naturally.
[00:10:56.340] - Brandon Reece
Yeah, naturally. It makes you a faster fighter.
[00:10:59.450] - Chris Nordyke
Tell us What about these two weeks, man. You're a great storyteller. I want to hear more. Yeah.
[00:11:03.360] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah. So he got me out there. I moved into Pedigo submission fighting
[00:11:07.000] - Alejandro Wajner
. It was me and four or five other guys that were trying to become professional-level grapplers. We lived in this gym. It was called Dazy Fresh Laundermat. It was an old laundromat that he had rented out. I think he rented it for $500 a month. And we ripped everything out of the laundermat, and we just had mats in there. It was small. It was maybe one strip of mat you could fit in there. It was tiny. And no heat, no AC. Keep this in in the middle of Illinois. You know what I mean? And we slept on the mats. We slept on the floor. Sometimes we sleep on crash pads. I slept in there. It was tough. I found out pretty early that I wasn't going to be going anywhere. Not so much because obviously, the living situation was tough, but the training was exceptionally good. It was very high-level training. When I was in St. Louis, I was running the Brazilian jiu-jitsu circuit to help my MMA, and I was beating people pretty successfully with very minimal amount of experience. Just with my collegiate wrestling experience, I was having a lot of success with a couple of little jiu-jitsu It was mixed in.
[00:12:00.930] - Alejandro Wajner
Before I actually moved to Mount Vernon, I had visited previously just to get some training in, and those guys just pummeled me. And I was so jaw dropped. Anyone that competes in grappling at the wrestling level, at a high level, and stuff like that, you chase That group of people that can push you. Because being a big fish in a small pond isn't going to get you to where you need to be. So I was obsessed with that place internally already, because every time I went there, I had to fight to the death with certain guys. I had guys that I would go neck and neck with. I had guys that would just beat me up. And then it's always good to have three tiers of people to improve you. People that help build your confidence, people to help test you, people that will just beat you up so that you have to work on certain things. And I was just really drawn to that. And that's what initially made me love it. But what really made me lock in on I'm staying here is that, Heath Pedigo, he genuinely cared about me and my success, not just on the mat in jiu-jitsu, but with my personal life.
[00:12:58.520] - Alejandro Wajner
And he just He told me, Look, I can tell you're a good guy. You seem like one of the most sincere, nicest guys I've ever met. I know you're dealing with a lot of crap with this girl. He's like, I've been there, too. And he just gave me a really good advice. And I didn't really realize it until later, maybe even years later, is that he took me under his wing, was mentoring me through this whole process without me even realizing it. I owe him for a lot of the success of being a leader myself in a lot of aspects, whether it be jiu-jitsu or coaching or wrestling or my business, et cetera. That's what really made me lock in there. My loyalty guilty for him for being so selfless to help me. I was nothing special. I hadn't won any titles or done anything yet. I was still really young. I think I was just turned 23 when I moved to Mount Vernon full-time. So for him to go out of his way to really help a guy like me. And he just helped me get over a girl. I've seen him help people save their lives, help them through all types of really way more bigger level stuff.
[00:13:52.750] - Alejandro Wajner
But to me, it was like he gave me a second chance in life. And I was very grateful for that. And I've been with him ever since. Even when things got hard, man, I stuck through it with him, and things have only gotten better and better and better.
[00:14:02.500] - Brandon Reece
It's almost been 10 years. It's so interesting because it's hard for me to ignore. I've seen some of the pictures of the laundermat back in the day, and it's this man has, and we're going to get into it a little bit when we hear more about your career in jiu-jitsu and what you've been able to accomplish. But this guy is creating loyalty with fighters. For those that don't know, this particular group has produced a lot of real class act fighters, high-degree, high-winning fighters. Like you He talked about in the facility, nothing. Like an old converted laundromat, no heat, no AC, very bare bones. There was no glitz and glamor, yet he created this unbelievably capable team, high-performing, loyal team. It sounds like the bulk of that was done on the base of relationship, him leaning in and really caring about you guys.
[00:14:50.390] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, he did the opposite of what most coaches tell you growing up. I'm not your friend, I'm your coach. He's the opposite. In a lot of aspects, there's a lot of professionalism that goes out of the door and stuff like that when you do things like that. But he didn't care. He genuinely wanted his guys and his athletes to know that he had their back. And every single person that walks through that door knows that after a small amount of time of being around Heath or being coached by Heath, that this guy genuinely cares about you. He's messaging you about how you're feeling, how you're doing, how's life. He's got your back, man. And he gets these guys and girls and all these athletes to move here from all over the world, from all different places in a walks of life with way nicer stuff. They're moving into Mount Vernon, Illinois, on a population of 15,000, just small little po-dont town to be a part of this because they feel this something. They feel this specialness about this place, and it's contagious. And now it's starting to bleed off into my wrestling program. We got kids moving, their family's moving to be a part of our wrestling program now.
[00:15:50.220] - Alejandro Wajner
So it's an infectious... Being nice to people and being caring, it's an infectious thing. People are drawn to it, especially when they feel like the person that's leading them really has their back. They're not just being told what to do.
[00:16:01.170] - Chris Nordyke
There's this picture for me in my mind where on the one hand, I know from knowing Wayne and all the things that he shared about the experience, there's a super hard core nature to the gym, both the training cadence, how often people are training. It's all day, end of the night. There's still people that sleep outside in the parking lot. It's like there's still some of that OG culture. Give us a day in the life of what does this leadership style look like? Because it sounds like very hard core on the one hand, super high level. Then there's also this heavy relationship component. I'm just curious how that looked and felt.
[00:16:36.200] - Alejandro Wajner
Some things have changed and some things haven't. The relationship component hasn't really changed. But we don't live... The Dazy Fresh laundermat, we actually left and moved three years ago. So we have a new facility now. It's a little bit bigger, bigger parking lot. But we don't have anyone living in the gym anymore. Okay. The reason... So we wrote it out as long as we could, but the city found out that we had people living in the gym. And we got a C-Sense. We got a It's a sixth letter. So we had 90 days to figure out a new place to get a gym. And so we have a nicer facility now. It's not anything crazy nice, but for us, it's like the Taj Mahal compared to that laundromat. And we'll miss that laundromat and all the memories that we had in it. But I don't miss living on that, man. Hard, hard, hard winters, brewy cold winters, brewerly hot summers. It was intense. But there's a lot of special things going on in that place. And there's camaraderie that was built. And people were changed living in there. You know what I mean? At one point, the laundry mat was getting so full of people living in there that there was all these people living outside in their cars, building shacks on the side of the building out of storage containers.
[00:17:44.260] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, the city We had clothes lines with people's like, gees drying, and people were starting to think it was a homeless shelter. So the city eventually came down on us and we moved. But it's all the same. We have a little bit nicer facility. My wrestling room is on the top floor. The The bottom floor is the jiu-jitsu, and it's great. We don't use the heat and AC very much anymore still to keep the electric bill down. But I pump the heat every once in a while during the wintertime for the kids.
[00:18:11.580] - Brandon Reece
What was that training environment like, though? Because Yeah, that's been our impression from Wayne is like, man, the guys that take it seriously, the men and women that take it seriously, it sounded like there was training that was literally going on all day, every day.
[00:18:25.260] - Alejandro Wajner
So every day, minimum, there was two training sessions a day. There was one morning, afternoon session, and then there was one night session always at 6: 00 PM. The professional level guys usually always trained in the morning. That was our pro-pro session. And then the night session was still a hard session, but it was the whole general population was there because everyone was getting off work, getting out of school, et cetera, et cetera. But we were jamming sometimes 60 people into that tiny enclosed space. During the wintertime, we never had to pump the heat. We just had to get out. We had one of those little rocket heaters with the propane, and we would just turn it on for the first 30 minutes to get the mat softened up enough because it was cold. But once people started moving around, there was 60 people in such a closed environment. There'd be steam shooting out of the windows because there'd be so much body heat in there. And we had to have fans running during the summer and sucking the hot air out. Otherwise, people will be crawling out of there overheating. But it was hard core, man.
[00:19:16.220] - Alejandro Wajner
Everyone was in there trying to chase a dream. So everyone's in there fighting hard, going at it. But at the same time, everyone's in there building each other up, going through the same stuff. And everyone's trying to help each other out. But it's a tough environment, man, because it takes away all your excuses living in Mount Vernon, because we've created an environment where the price of living in Mount Vernon is really not much. You can live there for very inexpensive, especially if you were living at the gym at the time. And all you needed to pay for... Yeah, Jimdo was at the time worth 50 bucks a month to train at one of the top gyms in the world. It was nothing. And he made it so that there was no excuses. All you needed money was for a $50 Jimdo, food, and then your tournaments. So if you wanted to be a professional grappler and have a chance at winning a world titles And the American titles, this was it. What you're going to have to sacrifice was your comfort. And you're going to have to be uncomfortable, probably for longer than you'd like, because everyone comes there thinking, I'm here, I'm going to be a world champ.
[00:20:10.170] - Alejandro Wajner
But a lot of people weren't willing to put in the months of time, years of time. You know what I mean? We've had people come and they spend a couple of days in, I'm out. A couple of weeks there, they're like, I'm out. A couple of months, a couple of years even, and not follow through. Because it's tough, man. Getting beat up every day, being hurt, because it's a tough sport, especially doing two a days. And everyone's at different ages. When I got there, I was 23. I'm 32 now. So a lot changes for people, and it's tough. But we all do a really good job of making sure everyone has each other's back and help getting everybody through it. But it's a tough one to sell to a lot of people because Obviously, everyone wants immediate gratification and wants results really quick, but it's a long hustle.
[00:20:50.660] - Brandon Reece
So talk about your career, man, because you moved. You moved through the ranks. You put your time in and saw some successes there. Can you give us a rundown of what that looked like?
[00:21:00.880] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, it was tough, man. And I found out pretty early how tough and how hard it was going to be. I remember asking he when I was brand new there, I said, How long, honestly, do you think it's going to take for me to win an adult medal at one of these open tournaments? Not even at a major tournament, like a Pan-American or a world title. I said, How long would it take for me to win a medal at one of these high-level US Open tournaments through the IBJM? And he was like, You're not going to like what I have to tell you, but it's going to probably take about two years of hard training for you to be successful consistently at that level. And I was like, two years.
[00:21:32.560] - Brandon Reece
In the long run, man. All right, I'm here.
[00:21:35.340] - Alejandro Wajner
And you know what? The son of a bitch was right. It took me about two years to finally start getting on that podium. But once you get on that podium, it's hard to get off, man. You stay consistent, you stay on there. So I ran the circuit pretty hard. I competed consistently all over the United States. I went to the Europeans. I really stayed active. Me and a handful of others on our team, we really stayed at it. And on top of gold medals in the opens and stuff like that, silver, bronze, I Eventually, I took bronze at the Pan Am's at Blue Belt, like two times. I took silver at Purple. I took bronze again at Brown Belt Adult. I actually took bronze at Brown Belt Adult twice. And then I won the World Championships in the Gee at Brown Belt. And then just recently, over the summer, I got my black belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu.
[00:22:18.020] - Brandon Reece
Wow. Ten years. Were you doing any of that prior to? It was just the wrestling, right? You hadn't been exposed to that.
[00:22:25.030] - Alejandro Wajner
I was just wrestling from ninth grade all the way through college, and I messed around with jiu-jitsu. Just for fun. But I didn't really take it seriously, probably until the end of 2016.
[00:22:35.820] - Chris Nordyke
How would you describe the difference between jiu-jitsu and wrestling? Because my boy just started training at a local jiu-jitsu gym a couple of months ago, and he's super fired up and excited. He also did his first year of high school wrestling last year. So he experienced-He's like 15? Yeah. He has talked about how dramatically different the culture is between wrestling and jiu-jitsu and how he feels It's like the wrestling has helped him a lot coming into jiu-jitsu. But he's also just talked about how radically different it is. I'm just curious, from your perspective of people that are listening, that have been thinking about all this, what's your thoughts on that? What are the differences?
[00:23:11.060] - Alejandro Wajner
I agree with him 100%. Restaurings are a very Be tough. Let's go hard. Push yourself harder. Go, go, go, go, go, type sport, especially old school. I mean, a lot has changed in the last couple of years with technology and people learning more, yada, yada, yada. But it's a very gritty, tough, tough, sport. And I've learned that, obviously, by doing it in the last five years coaching, it's very different. Jujutsus is like most gyms. They're like, take it easy, go slow. The pace isn't as aggressive, but it can be. It totally can be. Consistent-wise, I'd say 80 % to 85 % of wrestling practices are go, go, go. Whereas jiu-jitsu, it's like the last 25 % of practice or something like that. And I totally agree. I think the biggest investment for your jujutsu is definitely doing wrestling. So if When you're a high school kid and you think jiu-jitsu is going to be something you're going to do for a long period of time, I know it'll suck, but invest those four years of high school and just do the high school wrestling. Because you'll be an adult, my age or your guys' age, and you'll be like, damn, man, I wish I were to wrestle in high school.
[00:24:13.140] - Alejandro Wajner
This is only four years of my life. You look back as an adult, you're like, Man, it was only four years of my life. Why didn't I do it? But when you're in high school, you're like, I want to get a job or I want to chase girls, or whatever. I try to tell that to all the kids I coach, but it's tough. And I think that's what's special about PSF at our gym is that We're like a hybrid of wrestling and jiu-jitsu. And I think that's why we get a lot of ex-collegiate wrest that end up with us. And they have a lot of success because a lot of these guys that have success with us, a lot of them are already coached at a professional level. Because when some people come in, they have to be coached on how to be coached or absorb information. And I think that's why we have a lot of success with some of our ex- College wrestlers that come in and do jiu-jitsu with us because they're ready to rock and roll. But yeah, it's a big gap. It's all on the mat. Same muscles are being used, but Pace is definitely a little different.
[00:25:01.650] - Alejandro Wajner
But if you can mix the both together, you're well-earned, machining, it's ready to go.
[00:25:05.380] - Chris Nordyke
Yeah, it toughened him up. I think the way he described the wrestling culture, and he was at a little Christian private school. Presumably, it's a little softer maybe in some of the other environments. But he's like, the culture is you grind people down and beat people up as hard as you can go. There's a culture of domination in the wrestling side, whereas his experience so far in jiu-jitsu is there's much more collaborative It's a co-learning. It's part of the culture where you don't feel like everybody's trying to beat you up every time you roll. So he just saw that as a dramatic change.
[00:25:39.520] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, it's a wrestling, even if it's something that you're only going to do a couple of years in high school or just only through high school, I've watched it change and save and improve so many kids' lives, especially in this day and age, where kids are obsessed with technology and their phones and doing other things that just... Some kids just don't have sports or objectives yet. You know what I mean? In high school, you just don't know what to do. And I like to tell it like this to most of the kids. I say, listen, give it a shot. It'll be hard. We make ourselves very available to the kids. We make them know that we'll be there. We'll be a support system to them on and off the mat. It's a very demanding sport. You're demanding three to four months of intense, intense training to kids that might have never even felt this type of physical trauma, mental anguish and exhaustion before in their life. So I just tell them, Look, if you can handle this, you'll go through life and you'll get... Things will happen to you and you'll be able to get through it because this will be some of the hardest stuff you've ever done in your life.
[00:26:33.900] - Alejandro Wajner
Because I'm not going to lie to you, this will be the hardest stuff, some of the hardest stuff you'll ever go through. And I watched it change lives. Kids that weigh 340 pounds, losing 150 pounds. Kids that have There's no purpose in life. We're running with rough crowds or doing bad things and finally honing into something and giving them a chance at life. Kids that didn't have friends or just didn't fit in. Having a group of people for the first time to hang out with. So it's done a lot. And that's where Coaching at the high school level is really... It feels good because not only are you getting kids really good, really fast, especially if they're brand new, but you're developing human beings. Because a lot of these kids, a lot of them have great parents, but a lot of their parents are busy working, or maybe they don't have great parents and they're not around. Maybe they're being raised by a grandma or an uncle or they're in foster care. So you really get to be at the forefront of building young humans into adults.
[00:27:24.140] - Brandon Reece
That's really powerful. I'm curious, just as you were working your way through the ranks and earning some of these wins, what was going on in your mind just in terms of that combination of keep working harder, keep being driven to level up, but then experiencing the success? What was that push and pull relationship for you as you were advancing in your ranks in the jiu-jitsu sport?
[00:27:49.430] - Alejandro Wajner
Like while I was coaching?
[00:27:50.580] - Brandon Reece
No, while you were actually fighting. Yeah.
[00:27:52.430] - Alejandro Wajner
Okay. Yeah. It's just like, I always knew that it was going to be a long hustle. And I always told myself, look, I'm only a blue belt, or I'm only a purple belt, or I'm I'm only a brown belt, or I've only been doing this so many years. You know what I mean? I always knew. He's always told us it's going to be worth it. It's going to be brutal. But this is how all the best guys came up. You just got to get through it and keep learning. And it's the truth, man. You got to think of it like this, like your black belt is like your PhD. I got a long try to get to that. And the struggle between when I started to that is going to be tough, and I'm going to go through all highs and lows. And there's times where I doubt myself or don't want to do certain things. But that's what it takes to separate yourself from everybody else. So regardless of what was going on in my life, I always could guarantee and count on one thing. Well, really, two things. That practice was going to be at 12: 00 PM, 6: 00 PM, Monday through Friday.
[00:28:41.300] - Alejandro Wajner
So I just stuck to the plan. I knew it was going to be a long hustle. My coaches and my teammates never quit on me, so why should I quit on them? And I came into the gym at a point where I was one of the first guys to be a part of it because I saw myself as an example. I knew people were watching me and I was one of the older guys. And I just knew, regardless It was really my success, whether I won a tournament or whether I didn't even place or get on the podium, my attitude and my perseverance and the way I kept myself and the way I showed up to practice after a loss or win, and the way I prepared before one, those are the things that people were watching. You don't realize how much people are watching you until you start coaching kids, too. You get kids that come up to you four years after you coach them. They're like, Man, when you said this to me back when I was this age, it really meant a lot. And you're like, Man, I didn't even think that was a big of a deal.
[00:29:27.590] - Alejandro Wajner
But for them, it was a life-changing sentence you said to them. I always just imagine that everyone was watching. I wanted to be great, not just for myself, but for he and for his brand, for the team that he created. It did so much for me. It was the least I could do to represent.
[00:29:45.880] - Brandon Reece
Man, you just probably summarized what I think probably every company would want to establish. It's difficult. But if we just think about what you just shared, this idea that you felt supported to the extent that you were very loyal to contributing to the future benefit in the way that people perceived the gym and your team. Then in addition to that, you being super aware of your actions, your behavior, your attitude, how you showed up, and how that was influencing for the good or potentially for the bad. I mean, this is the stuff that every company culture probably would love to set the stage with and establish, where we have an entire team of people that are aware, paying attention to how they're showing up, how they carry themselves because of the influence that they may be having on newer team members or someone lower down in the org chart. Then this idea of a loyal team that carries themselves in such a way that they want to honor and respect the brand. You just summarized, I think, and from my perspective, what the perfect company culture looks like and feels like. I think it's pretty hard to ignore in your story how much the relationship between leaders, the coach, if you will, and the team members, how that created that space and that environment.
[00:31:00.630] - Brandon Reece
I think, Chris, you alluded to this, but I just want to make sure we take a second to dive into this a little bit. Clearly, the way that he checked in with you, asked questions, showed that he cared about your real life off the mat, that had a profound effect. But how was that balanced with the work hard, train hard, high standards and expectations? How was that drilled into the team on a day to day basis?
[00:31:24.690] - Alejandro Wajner
I mean, he ran it. At one point, it was like, we're cool, we're friends. But when we were working, We're working. You know what I mean? And he had that understanding with us that there's a point that where we have to switch gears and get serious and lock in to get what we want done. And there was also times where he made himself very available to us, where we needed help sometimes mentally, physically, with work, et cetera, et cetera. But there was times where we didn't even realize that he was doing us a favor, but he wouldn't answer our questions, or he wouldn't make himself available on purpose to force us to have to figure it out on our own. These are things that I realized later down the road. But in the moment, I'm like, why can't he get a hold of me? Why isn't he teaching me this? Why isn't he showing me? So he was very methodical with how he mentored us and how he instructed us because he gave us a lot, but he didn't give us everything to where we couldn't do without him.
[00:32:12.710] - Chris Nordyke
Yeah, say more about that. Can you think of some example That's really good.
[00:32:16.840] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah. So he would do this thing sometimes where he wouldn't purposely not answer his phone, but he would be watching through one of the side windows to see how we would react and how we would... Because he said he's watched studies on how What your athletes will do when you're not around if you don't show up to practice. And then he could determine how he can help build certain athletes and what's actually athletes who are doing things on their own without having to be told and just stuff like that. And even with just problem problem solving simple things, say, training got canceled for whatever reason and us having to figure out on our own, get a group together, or even simpler things like ride situations. He got to teach simple people skills to us sometimes, too. We're a bunch of low lives that live in a gym.
[00:33:04.260] - Brandon Reece
I just think I'm laughing even more just because I'm thinking about all of Wayne's stories about people carpooling. I think carpooling is probably a loose use of the term. Then the mass amount of people sharing single rooms because you're all broke fighters and trying to be on the road for these championships and these tournaments.
[00:33:25.180] - Alejandro Wajner
It was wild. Literally, at times, seven of us in the same room, sometimes 15 of us in the same room.
[00:33:31.860] - Brandon Reece
Oh, my God.
[00:33:32.440] - Alejandro Wajner
With one bathroom, no shower.
[00:33:35.020] - Brandon Reece
Oh, my God.
[00:33:35.820] - Alejandro Wajner
We had a makeshift camping shower with a bag and a hose that hang from it outside. At some point, I eventually made friends with other teammates that had homes, and I would just go and shower their house.
[00:33:47.400] - Brandon Reece
Get your showers there.
[00:33:49.220] - Chris Nordyke
Oh, my goodness.
[00:33:49.820] - Alejandro Wajner
There was dudes that would have the big totes. They'd have big totes filled them with water, and they'd be homeless people scrubbing them.
[00:33:56.620] - Brandon Reece
That's dedication. We're freaking diehard. Yeah, wild. Well, take us into your more current status right now. So obviously, you've started a business and you're coaching both the high school team, it sounded like, and you've got this every day, right? Coaching and gym that you guys are running on the wrestling side. Bring us up to speed. What does that look like? What are you focused on?
[00:34:16.250] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah. So in my life now, I'm the head coach at Mount Vernon Township High School over here in Southern Illinois. This is my fifth year, my fifth season coaching them. And then I'm also a co-owner of PSF wrestling Academy. Me and Michael Pitzley, he's a very well accolated wrestler and well accolated jiu-jitsu athlete. He's one of the top ranked grapplers on the planet right now. And him and I, we both run the wrestling academy together upstairs right on top of the jiu-jitsu. And we've been doing that. This is our fourth season doing that. So after the first year coaching at the high school, we both realized we needed to have a Feeder program to get little younger kids started off so that when they get to ninth grade, we don't have to spend so much time building. It's just sharpening their tools. And now in year five, we're starting see that coming to fruition because now we're getting kids that we've been working with for the last three and a half years coming in as ninth graders. They're starting to come in a little bit nicer.
[00:35:07.920] - Brandon Reece
That was pretty proactive. You guys were thinking about the wrestling team of the future. How do we ensure that we've got good talent coming into the system?
[00:35:16.740] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah, because the program down here was dead. The only reason we even wanted to... Because we didn't honestly at the time, we didn't really want the responsibility of being head coaches or coaches at high school. But they were going to kill the local high school program that had been around for over 30 years Because it was abysmal. The coach that had it at the time wasn't really in it. And the program had four kids on me teaming him, and they had won a duel in 10 years. And the school was just getting ready to kill the program as a whole. So we had a couple of people reach out, and they were like, look, and We wanted to offer it to you guys because we're going to kill it if someone doesn't. And I was like, I don't know if I want to do it. It's a lot because if I'm going to coach, I'm going to do it right, just like you do. And he was like, look, you know your shit about wrestling. Michael's an NCAA champion. You got two other, three other guys that wrest in college. If there was a group of people to do it, this is the time to do it.
[00:36:05.000] - Alejandro Wajner
I don't know when another opportunity will come around where you can pick your whole staff and have a chance to do it like this. So we just said, you know what? Maybe he's right. This is the chance to do it. And we did it. And we had a winning season our first year for the first time in a decade. And the following year, we won the regional championships for the first time in 35 years. And then the year after that, we repeated. And we've sent a kid to the state Championship every year. We've coached. We've sent kids to college every year we've coached. And the high school was really grown up. And it's only going to get better because of that theater program. After that first year, we realized we needed to get kids because the kids program in our area wasn't necessarily abysmo. There was a kids program, but it needed more. It was a bunch of dads that cared about wrestling, that wanted their kids to be good, but they didn't really know how to run the program efficiently. We sat down with the people that were running the local kids club, and we absorbed it.
[00:36:52.920] - Alejandro Wajner
We talked to them, and we absorbed their club. We rebranded it to the PSF wrestling academy, and then we just blew it up from there. Right now, we're the biggest and most successful club in the Southern Illinois area.
[00:37:03.160] - Brandon Reece
Right on. Tell us a little bit more about the group dynamics. What is the age range as a kids that you guys are partnering with in the academy?
[00:37:10.670] - Alejandro Wajner
Ages 4-18.
[00:37:12.240] - Brandon Reece
Four to 18? Yeah.
[00:37:14.110] - Alejandro Wajner
Wow. Yeah. So during the high school season, it splits. We don't coach high school kids in the high school season because they're with their actual high schools. We'll do private lessons and stuff with them. But during the winter season, the PSF wrestling academy focuses solely on grade school kids ages Florida 13. And we run our club season all through the winter pretty hard. We have a group. We have two sessions. We have a beginner-ish group for the young kids and the beginner kids. And then we have a group right after that, which is for our elite kids. And Our goal for those beginner, younger kids is to eventually get into that elite class. So we have two different classes, one to teach them how to crawl and then one to hit the ground running and get right.
[00:37:55.920] - Brandon Reece
Are you a business that's under 5 million in sales? And you're just now getting ready to try and scale your company up and hit some of those targets you've always wanted to hit. But now you've got to build a sales team, or maybe you just hired your first sales rep, but you don't really know how to manage them. How do you manage, lead, train, develop a sales rep? Floodlight has a solution for you now. So we can actually assign your sales rep a turnkey VP of sales that will help them create a sales blueprint, their own personal sales plan for your market. They'll have weekly one-on-ones with that sales rep to coach, mentor them, hold them accountable to the plan, and they'll They also have a monthly owners meeting where they'll meet with you or your general manager and review the progress of that sales rep, their plan to actual results, what performance improvement they're working on with them. Also let them know, Hey, you might, they're doing really well. Maybe we should think of hiring a second sales rep. They're going to have that one-to-one advice for you as an owner or senior leader on the team as well.
[00:38:49.670] - Brandon Reece
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[00:39:01.580] - Chris Nordyke
Our floodlight clients this last year in 2024 generated over 250 million in revenue, supported by, advised by an industry expert who's owned and operated a business just like you. So take action. Don't kick the can down the road. Start with our business health and value assessment, and let's unlock the next chapter of your success story.
[00:39:22.560] - Brandon Reece
Do you guys do any summer programs?
[00:39:24.200] - Chris Nordyke
Can the kids fly in to do a week long camp or anything like that? Oh, yeah.
[00:39:28.190] - Alejandro Wajner
Oh, yeah? We got kids that come here all the I have a little fighter barracks attached to my property that I live at. And depending on the age of the kid, sometimes I'll let high schoolers live in the fighter barracks for a couple of bucks a week or whatever. And they stay, and they do the whole trading regimen with us. I'll even have them do jiu-jitsu with us if they want to try jiu-jitsu. We get people, especially during the summer, they want to come and live the lifestyle. Because our high school group is hardcore in the summer. We got state champions from 20 different high schools that come and train with us.
[00:39:55.070] - Brandon Reece
Oh, wow. Jeez. I'm hearing gears turning in Chris's head right now.
[00:39:58.720] - Chris Nordyke
Yeah, my son Simon He's nerding out on wrestling. He really liked it. It was really hard, but he's drawn to it. The sophistication of it. How big is he? The sophistication of it. He's a small kid. He hasn't really hit his full growth spurt yet. He's a freshman. It's like 120? Not quite.
[00:40:12.600] - Alejandro Wajner
105. 10? Oh, perfect. That's fine. We got a bunch of guys his size.
[00:40:16.250] - Chris Nordyke
I'll send them down. Hopefully by summer. He's hoping anyways. He's a little bit bigger like his brother by summer. We'll see. Yeah.
[00:40:22.540] - Alejandro Wajner
Don't worry. We got a ton of guys right around his age and size.
[00:40:25.340] - Brandon Reece
That's freaking super cool. All right, this has been awesome, man. I think as we I'll draw this to a close. There's just a couple of things I want to pull out of you. So just as you look back over your career, obviously, you chalked up a ton of success, made your way all the way to the PhD, as you said, with the black belt. And one thing just for listeners, there is a distinct difference between, I think you guys refer to it as retail, jiu-jitsu, and the stuff that some of these champions are training under and coming out from. So 10 years to a black belt in a real fighting environment is substantially different than, let's say, making their way through the retail ranks. Is that fair to say or am I- No, that's totally fair to say.
[00:41:05.970] - Alejandro Wajner
But I mean, it's really up to what you want and out of it. You know what I mean? There's guys that they want what I wanted out of it. And then there's a guy that works a nine to five And he's got five kids and he wants to get a good workout, maybe learn a little self-defense and hang out with a cool group of guys. You know what I mean? So I mean, there has to be an understanding, I think, and realism. If people don't know about that, some people, maybe their gym is blinding them to that, or maybe they just honestly don't know. But I mean, you just have to know what you want. I don't think that my black belt is special than Joe Schmo that's 60 years old, that has six kids and works 60 hours a week. It comes in when he can. He just put in his time and got a belt. You know what I mean? Yeah. I think everyone's journey is different. And I think you just got to know exactly what you want to get out of it.
[00:41:48.880] - Brandon Reece
Yeah, that's super helpful.
[00:41:50.670] - Chris Nordyke
I'm thinking about the conversation we just recorded a podcast with Ben Richiardi. He runs a marketing company and an excavation company in Florida. And he managed to pepper it into our conversation a couple of times, just what he started jiu-jitsu, I think two or three years ago, maybe. Yeah. You just hear the language of people that are picking up jiu-jitsu later in life. I had an experience. I hurt myself, I broke my hand, and I didn't end up going back to it, but I spent about three months in it. It was actually a really profound experience for me as a late 30s something guy back when I did it. I'm curious, what do you think it is about specifically jiu-jitsu that seems to be so transformative for adults that come to it later in life?
[00:42:29.230] - Alejandro Wajner
I just think there's a... I think a lot of people just have never felt physical. No one likes being controlled or being uncomfortable or not having success. So I think it really exposes a lot of people's egos, even in people's egos that they didn't know they had. But then I think seeing little achievements and overcoming certain things is a really gratifying feeling, even as a beginner, because you come in that first day and you don't know crap. But in that first day, you're going to learn a couple of things. You know what I mean? And then the next day after that, you're going to learn a couple more things. And then the next week, you'll be like, oh, I used to get caught in this submission all the time, and now I'm not. Maybe there was a guy that was in there that used to whip your butt. And then three months in or a year in, you finally scored on him or submitted him. So there's a lot of trial and error and self-growth that you can get out of jiu-jitsu. And it's very raw. It's very real, and it's very cut and dry, especially from an outside perspective.
[00:43:22.320] - Alejandro Wajner
Sometimes when you're in it, you can be really hard on yourself. But I think you got to remember, it's a long hustle. There's a small % of people that would just coming in jiu-jitsu and just whip everybody. And those guys, they're usually ex-collegiate Olympic-level type people. So I think it's just a very humbling and religious experience to feel it because it's not like you have to wait for it to magically happen. You can feel the jiu-jitsu. It's a physical thing. So I think it's a very gratifying thing you get right there and then, whether it's in the moment or whether it's in that journey. Especially for people that are getting older, once you get out of high school or you're in college, you spend that mid part of your life grinding in the studying or working hard. You're not in the high school sports anymore. But now you have this little thing that you can do an hour out of your day and get back on the mat with other guys your age and stuff or younger guys and feel young again. Feel adversity and then learn from it and get in shape.
[00:44:14.720] - Chris Nordyke
It's a lot of things. Yeah, I think for me, you talk about the humility, and it's like a safe place to get humbled, where it's like everybody gets humbled. I remember I'm a 200 pound plus guy and it lift weights and all the things. And when I showed up my very first time, a girl that was, no doubt, like 125 pounds, put the hurt on me. Yeah, that's crazy. It was incredibly humbling, but it was a safe humbling. Nobody made fun of me. You know what I mean? Nobody was like, you let a girl beat? No, it wasn't that at all. It was this internal knowing of, okay, I have this new thing I need to develop. I've got something in front of me that I can build on here. And you're right, you just feel it. There's this knowing. There's this truth to jiu-jitsu where everything is equal when you show up to a jiu-jitsu gym. It doesn't matter how muscly somebody is. It doesn't matter necessarily even how much they weigh, what gender they are. There are some people that are going to surprise you almost every time you show up, right?
[00:45:16.220] - Alejandro Wajner
It's a very fair experience. You know what I mean? Obviously, people could cheat and do weird things. But I mean, everyone's going to learn the same technique. And so many people come from different experiences and walks of life. I've seen so many different types of people People that were like, don't have a dime to their name, broke, suck at all types of stuff to people that are like CEOs of companies. And they can both learn, enjoy the mat together. You'll get ex criminals on the mat with state cops or the state's attorney They're in there rolling, hanging out. That's what it's like in Mount Vernon. You got these like tattoos on their face, rolling around with the state's attorney. It's a special place. Some gyms are different, sure. But for my experience at PSF, it was a very special special place where everybody from different walks of lives, very different education levels, could all come and learn something at the same level together.
[00:46:08.380] - Brandon Reece
You've brought quite a few people to the gym. I mean, you became a bit of a prophet and started recruiting. So obviously, you have a sibling that made their way there. But I mean, how many people have you had some role in bringing them into the sport or that team?
[00:46:23.290] - Alejandro Wajner
So I'm just really proud to be a part of this. Even before we grew up on Flow, for those of you that don't know anything about our or at Jujutsu or anything like that, and you want to hear more about what we did, what happened, feel free to go on the Flow Grappling's YouTube channel and just put in daisy French. We have three full seasons of how we grew up in the laundromat and how we all did it and competing all over, and it covers a whole story. Heath, me, all the guys. It's all free on YouTube. Put it in there, and you'll get the play-by-play. But I was just so proud of what Heath did for me and what he did for the guys before that show even début, because when it début, it blew up, and a lot of people started coming. And Even after that, I just wanted to spread what he did for me to everybody else. Because like I said, all he helped me do was get over some girl, but it was like he saved my life and gave me a second life. I knew he could do so much more for everybody else.
[00:47:10.520] - Alejandro Wajner
I know there's better athletes out there. I wanted everyone to get a piece. So I just always went out of my way to make sure everyone had a chance to come. So Jacob Couch, he's a very successful world champion. I contacted him and literally physically drove five hours all the way out to Kentucky and picked him up and brought him to Mount Vernon. And he ended up staying. He's still out here with us. My own sister, she got done wrestling. She's an NCAA All-American track runner, burdeler, and she didn't know what to do with her life after college. Being nearly a professional athlete in college sports, it just was lost. I just told her to come down here and hang out for a little bit. It's a good environment. And she ended up staying out here. I ended up being a pants finalist in jiu-jitsu. I've reached out to countless others, and I've probably contacted thousands of people to come out here, and they probably came. But I know at least 10 % of the 100 or so people at our gym, I at least probably had some hand in getting them here.
[00:47:59.580] - Brandon Reece
That's It's pretty epic. So obviously, man, you're having a profound influence in the community, in the environment, the youth. I want to be able to point people to them because I think Chris probably isn't the only one that potentially has a son or a daughter that's interested in maybe potentially exploring. How do they find out more specifically about the wrestling program? Where would we point them for that?
[00:48:22.040] - Alejandro Wajner
Yeah. The best thing you could do is go to some of our social media pages at PSF wrestling on Instagram, PSF wrestling on Facebook, and then TikTok. You can also check out our website, psfrestling. Com. Okay. And feel free to email us at psfrestling@gmail. Com.
[00:48:37.560] - Brandon Reece
Okay, psfrestling@gmail. Com. And one more time, what was the YouTube channel? Because I've seen some of it, and it's actually super epic. So what is it specifically that they can go see?
[00:48:47.930] - Alejandro Wajner
The three seasons of a Dazy Fresh American Jujutsi Story is on Flow Grappling's channel on the YouTube. You just put in Dazy Fresh, and they'll have season one, episode two, whatever. Seasons one through three on there. It's all three. And then on top of that, we built our own YouTube channel at some point, too. We need to upload some more newer content, but we got probably a couple of hundred videos of content on our own personal YouTube channel. Just Dazy Fresh, the Dazy Fresh YouTube channel on YouTube. There's a bunch of stuff on there, too. And if you just want to learn more about what we do and some of the matchings we've done, some of the places we travel, we got blogs on there, hours and hours of content, and just shows what we've been through and how we got to where we've been. But just Just so you guys know, I have hair in some of those early videos, so you might not recognize me.
[00:49:34.360] - Brandon Reece
You might not recognize me.
[00:49:35.300] - Alejandro Wajner
But that's me. I just had hair. I started coaching wrestling, and all the kids that stressed me out so much, all my hair fell out.
[00:49:42.620] - Chris Nordyke
Well, we also used to have hair at one point. Yeah.
[00:49:45.660] - Alejandro Wajner
We all weren't born like this?
[00:49:47.660] - Chris Nordyke
No, right? That's surprising.
[00:49:49.120] - Brandon Reece
Technically, I was. Then I went through a phase with her. That's probably how it goes. Man, this was fun. Just a super cool experience to learn a little bit more behind the scenes. As we've said, I think jiu-jitsu in general right now has just picked up a whole new recognition in the business and leadership environment as an experience that enhances your life and business competency. I think you're a perfect example of that. The time and energy that you dedicated to this sport has just continued to influence you. Now look at the level of influence that you're having and the give back in the community. It's a cool story, man. We really appreciate you hanging out with us and sharing just a part of what that looked like.
[00:50:28.840] - Alejandro Wajner
Sure. Yeah, man. It It really is a jiu-jitsu and running a gym and all this stuff. It really is similar to running a successful business in the workplace. So it really does go hand in hand because you have leaders on a team, you got leaders in the workplace, you got captains, and it trickles down from there just to make sure that this whole entire machine works properly.
[00:50:46.850] - Brandon Reece
Yeah, I love it, dude. Nicely done, man. And again, thanks for your time. Appreciate it, brother. Yeah, of course, guys. All right, everybody. Hey, thanks for joining us for another episode of Head, Heart, and Boots.
[00:50:58.700] - Brandon Reece
And if you're enjoying the show, or you love this episode, please hit follow, formerly known as subscribe, write us a review, or share this episode with a friend.
[00:51:08.000] - Alejandro Wajner
Share it on LinkedIn, share it via text, whatever.
[00:51:10.480] - Brandon Reece
It all helps.
[00:51:11.460] - Chris Nordyke
Thanks for listening.